Lifting in the lineout.

So we've have that thread about Scrums, how's about Lineouts.

I was watching the England vs NZ match in the autumn with my dad. He played his rugby in the '50s , only at school level, but played a fair bit, starting out in the pack and ending as a no. 10 (all the other lads grew and he didn't) he was astonished to see lifting in the lineouts and asked me why the ref wasn't blowing it up. I explained the modern interpretation was that you could hold yer man in the air, so long as you didn't lift him. He thought this was bonkers as how on earth are you meant to tell. which reminded me of my days on the pitch wondering exactly the same thing, and lifting loads of 2nd rows up 4-6" and never being penalised for it as how can the ref tell?

So how about a return to more sane lineouts, where if anyone touched the jumper in the air (with the exception of the other team's jumper who has to be going for the ball) it's a foul?

We could do that, though certain teams would be very happy to revert to picking giant locks and happily giving away penalties.

I don't see a problem with what we have at the moment to be honest. It's part of the game that's evolved and changed, introducing more players requires more skills and tactical thinking I believe. It's not like the scrum where it's now a massive mess, just an evolution of the game.

The question to be answered is to what extent is it a restart of the game, to what extend a contest for the ball, and from that what sort of % should be won by the team throwing in?

And what sort of ball should be available to attack off?

depends how good the team throwing in is

I play scrummie so might not be the best qualified to comment, but i really like the lineouts both at club level and watching the pros. I think they bring a brilliant element to tactical restarts, the welsh 15 man lineout was a surprise and great to see. As to lifting, i see it as raggs said, an evolution. Having a lifter jumper combination is one of the best ways of restarting any game and brings a whole range of options and variations. It also perhaps leads to variations of physicality around the locks and props.

Having played around the time there was the switch of interpretation i have to agree, this is an evolution, I was suddenly able to jump about 4-6 ft instead of the previous 2, i'll put that down to good preseason .
In my opinion it is still a contest (unlike the scrums), admittedly not a 50/50 contest, more like 70/30 but this has changed many other laws because of the shift in contest.
The lineouts are easier to ref (when i have reffed) and everything is more visible, and i think (in most instances) the refs get the balance right, however there is the risk this too could become a farce if the interpretations or the laws change further. (Or they stop picking things like "not straight" as they have done with the scrums)

I completely agree with you about visibility, the main areas of concern at club level i have found is the guy in the air getting mullered to early which is dangerous, and mauls straight from the lineout just being awful, no one seems to know the rules or finds them impossible to use. The binding and go forward are simple enough as its often obvious when they are done incorrectly, but judging when they are being collapsed seems to be completely hit and miss.

Personally unless our forwards are marching upfield rapidly i take the ball as fast as possible.